Sind mit Delphi erstellte Programm sicherer?

[Sherlock]

Zitat von joachimd:

lass einfach Schwachstellenscanner dagegen laufen und schicke ihm den Bericht.

Einfach ist gut, die Dinger kosten einen Haufen Geld.

Ian Barker hat zu dem Thema kürzlich gebloggt: https://blogs.embarcadero.com/how-se...ecurity-holes/ Allein schon das hochladen meines Codes zu wem anderen finde ich problematisch.

[Kas Ob.]

Interesting subject and question, though i see deep and complex even more philosophical.

Security and its gap is limitless pit, there is no standard unless you define security and its gap, so what security means here, what your client may be failed to point and may be you also failed to understand his point of view.

Security in many cases is simple trust of chain, if i trust Daniel (the founder of this forum) with my information, then i obliged to trust the administrators he trusted with my information and so on, this a way to handle security and trust, is my email is secure here ? that can't be answered by simply yes or no.

Security most the time is simple as black or white, but there is cases where it is shades aka risk involvement, and this is huge factor many fail to consider.

Now to your question(s)
Is Delphi safer than C?, this can't be answer by yes or no, in general Delphi is less prone to overflow attacks, it is just harder to weaponize/exploit.
Is your client right with being afraid of your code? yes and the client is right not just always, but in this case, you obliged to give him peace of mind, for his money.

So:
1) you must understand him, his point of view and his trusted people, the ones that might be doing their jobs around him.
2) He rightfully doesn't trust you code, or may be doesn't trust you and your ability to write secured code, this is his right.
3) Why using Chrome, for me chrome is a security risk on its own.
4) Delphi on Virus Scanners like https://www.virustotal.com/ will do very badly on its own !
5) Ditch Chrome and adjust the EXE to minimal, switch to ( i can't believe i am saying it) Internet Explorer or Edge, this will help with Security scanners/analyzers.
6) Your client own the source, without it he will rightfully doubt the whole thing for ever, i recommend to give him the source in full, a compile-able source, and let him audit it, himself or by a 3rd party he trust, so ask you to build or if might prefer to ask a 3rd or even 4th party, that will give him the peace and trust he asking for.

When you have (6) on the table as offer without negotiating, thing will shift and the risk factor by his standard will drop greatly.

My 0.002 cent in short and sorry for bad English and sorry if that didn't help.

[joachimd]

Zitat von Sherlock:

Einfach ist gut, die Dinger kosten einen Haufen Geld.

KALI ist open source und kostenlos....billiger geht's kaum.

[DasWolf]

Zitat von Kas Ob.:

Interesting subject and question, though i see deep and complex even more philosophical.

Security and its gap is limitless pit, there is no standard unless you define security and its gap, so what security means here, what your client may be failed to point and may be you also failed to understand his point of view.

Security in many cases is simple trust of chain, if i trust Daniel (the founder of this forum) with my information, then i obliged to trust the administrators he trusted with my information and so on, this a way to handle security and trust, is my email is secure here ? that can't be answered by simply yes or no.

Security most the time is simple as black or white, but there is cases where it is shades aka risk involvement, and this is huge factor many fail to consider.

Now to your question(s)
Is Delphi safer than C?, this can't be answer by yes or no, in general Delphi is less prone to overflow attacks, it is just harder to weaponize/exploit.
Is your client right with being afraid of your code? yes and the client is right not just always, but in this case, you obliged to give him peace of mind, for his money.

So:
1) you must understand him, his point of view and his trusted people, the ones that might be doing their jobs around him.
2) He rightfully doesn't trust you code, or may be doesn't trust you and your ability to write secured code, this is his right.
3) Why using Chrome, for me chrome is a security risk on its own.
4) Delphi on Virus Scanners like https://www.virustotal.com/ will do very badly on its own !
5) Ditch Chrome and adjust the EXE to minimal, switch to ( i can't believe i am saying it) Internet Explorer or Edge, this will help with Security scanners/analyzers.
6) Your client own the source, without it he will rightfully doubt the whole thing for ever, i recommend to give him the source in full, a compile-able source, and let him audit it, himself or by a 3rd party he trust, so ask you to build or if might prefer to ask a 3rd or even 4th party, that will give him the peace and trust he asking for.

When you have (6) on the table as offer without negotiating, thing will shift and the risk factor by his standard will drop greatly.

My 0.002 cent in short and sorry for bad English and sorry if that didn't help.

Remove point 6. Why turn a customer's suspected or imaginary security concern into a real security issue for the provider/manufacturer?

Zum TE:
Du musst nicht erklären, warum Delphi-Software sicherer ist, sondern warum Deine Software sicher ist. Das muss kein Aufsatz sein oder eine komplette Beschreibung der Software. Da reicht einfach ein Ein- oder Zweizeiler. Du schließt einfach aus, dass Durch Deine Software ein Sicherheitsrisiko entsteht oder darüber Sicherheitslücken ausgenutzt werden können. Solltest Du Deine Software dahingehend schon diversen Tests unterzogen haben, kannst Du das vielleicht auch noch erwähnen (Stichwort Qualitätssicherung).

[Kas Ob.]

Zitat:

Remove point 6. Why turn a customer's suspected or imaginary security concern into a real security issue for the provider/manufacturer?

Because it is is right to take care of his business, security and managing his own risk factor.

OP question can interpreted as relative subject, in general you build a solution and market it, you should show some security concerns or at least mention them, to show your professionalism, so if the software on a web site with sales contact, you have to address potential clients question to each and every question, and if fact if you have like 100 clients 5 or 10 of them refuse due security or whatever concern you can't explain, then it is fine and your business is OK, that belongs to your own risk factor of losing clients, not matter the percent.
But if you are after one client, you are the one need to convince him then you and only you should make the compromise to satisfy him, it is simple market, offer and demand.

Zitat:

You don't have to explain why Delphi software is more secure, but rather why your software is secure.

Now to explain if Delphi is better or not, this is absolutely relative, for your it is crucial, for him, it is not, and i agree explaining your software is secure is the best way to go, but how without source and audit (review or whatever) ?
Almost every company out their show their clients list as card to gain trust and establish this trust chain, for small companies or individuals, your code is your proof, then your reputation, these two things goes hand by hand, the reputation level you gain the more client you will have, then less question about your code quality before hand will be asked.

[atari1040]

Eigentlich kann man nie Sicherheit garantieren und Risiken ausschliessen. Man kann nur garantieren, dass aktuell keine Sicherheitslücken bekannt sind, das man seine Software auf dem neuesten Stand hält und in der Zukunft eventuell bekannt werdende Sicherheitslücken umgehend beseitigt.

[Sherlock]

Zitat von joachimd:

Zitat von Sherlock:

Einfach ist gut, die Dinger kosten einen Haufen Geld.

KALI ist open source und kostenlos....billiger geht's kaum.

Das testet doch nur Netzwerksicherheit. Ich dachte es geht um allgemeine Sicherheit, wie die genannten Buffer Overflows oder SQL-Injection über Eingabefelder etc. Sorry, mein Fehler.
Noch eine dann vermutlich OT Randbemerkung, ich suche noch nach einem Produkt, daß zumindest statische Codeanalyse hinsichtlich Cybersecurity durchführt. Wie gesagt, teuer ist da gar kein Ausdruck.

O'Neill

[himitsu]

Zitat von Jasocul:

Oder, falls die SVG-Dateien irgendwo auf dem Rechner oder Netzwerk abgelegt sind, könnten diese unabhängig vom Programm manipuliert werden. Darauf hat das Programm dann keinen Einfluss.

Dann hat der Angreifer aber schon Zugriff auf das System. Dann sind Security-Probleme im Code von irgendwelchen Programmen auch (fast) egal.[/QUOTE]
Bezüglich dem "fast".

Wenn die SVG in einem ungeschützten Bereich von einem normalen Nutzer bearbeitet werden kann (bzw. von einem Programm mit diesen Rechten)
und diese Datei dann z.B. von einem Programm mit Admin- oder System-Rechten gelesen und verarbeitet wird,
dann bekommt dieser Code somit dann auch die höheren Rechte.

[jaenicke]

Es gibt viele Alternativen zur Anzeige von Animationen, z.B. Delphi SVG für SVGs, die komplett in Delphi implementiert sind und deren Quelltext man mit bekommt. Die Wahrscheinlichkeit, dass dort dann Sicherheitslücken ausgenutzt werden, ist geringer als bei weit verbreiteten riesigen Bibliotheken wie eine komplette Browserfunktionalität, die viel mehr potentiell gefährliche Funktionen haben.

[Sherlock]

Ich würde in der Tat erst dann einen Browser in meine Anwendung integrieren, wenn sonst absolut nichts geht - und damit meine ich auch selbst schreiben mit ca. einem Mannjahr Aufwand. Denn Browser öffnen dem entsprechend geneigten Menschen Tür und Tor.